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Linde

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I was just snooping around a little, and came to this definition of Cis from the Oxford language dictionary

"Cis-gen-der
adjective
denoting or relating to a person whose sense of personal identity and gender corresponds with their birth sex."

What would I be after if had SRS? My birth sex should have been female, according to my chromosomes, and just because the doc did not realize I had a birth defect, did not really make me male, he just declared me to be a male, because he did not know better.
Once i had my corrective surgery, to handle my birth defect, my personal identity, as well as my body appearance and gender would correspondent with my birth sex.

Wii i be cis after the surgery? What do you all think?

Hugs
Linde
 

Maddie

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My impression from your posts is that you've lived successfully as a man. Someone who adapted ok to the physical "defect" (male attributes) you were handed.

My uneducated speculation is it's possible that you might not even be in here co-piloting this boat of refuge if not for your Xs/Ys setup.

You're a retired cis-female male impersonator.

How about that?
 

NancyBalik

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Linde, I would say yes, but I think (related to another thread of yours) only the TERFs would care. I don’t think it matters a hoot. If it did, where does that leave the rest of us who are not so “chromosome-endowed?” Nancy
 

Linde

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Linde, I would say yes, but I think (related to another thread of yours) only the TERFs would care. I don’t think it matters a hoot. If it did, where does that leave the rest of us who are not so “chromosome-endowed?” Nancy
Nany, sometimes I really don't know if I am trans or just changed back into my birth roll.
Hearing how hard it is for a lot of trans women here, to smoothly transition, I feel kind of guilty that I just had to switch into female clothing, let my hair grow out, and I was a woman. I never had any body hair, I never had/have to shave my legs or arm pits, I have no Adams Apple, I had boobs already, and the only misfitting parts are my genitals, can this switch be called transition?


Hugs
Linde
My impression from your posts is that you've lived successfully as a man. Someone who adapted ok to the physical "defect" (male attributes) you were handed.

My uneducated speculation is it's possible that you might not even be in here co-piloting this boat of refuge if not for your Xs/Ys setup.

You're a retired cis-female male impersonator.

How about that?
Yep, I was one of the best crossdressers around FtM. Played the roll so well that I did not know myself that it was roll play only.


Hugs
Linde
 
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NancyBalik

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Obviously, the experience is different for everyone. Being “a woman” (IMO) is both psychology and biology. I am non-transitioning, not on hormones, and have never had hair on my arms, have not had any leg hair since my early 40’s, and have very little chest hair (Hooray!). My wife, who is (IMO) ultra-feminine, has to shave her legs and underarms every few days. What I am suggesting to you is that if your chromosomes make you “more of a woman,” you are buying into the TERF argument that you rally against elsewhere on this forum. I submit that your chromosomes don’t matter in this regard -- just sayin’ Nancy
 

Linde

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Nancy, me questioning if I am trans or not, has nothing to do with TERF's. I dislike those people a lot, and debate them to show how stupid they are, wherever I can. I just wonder, because some trans women told me that I am not really trans, and in Germany I can't be trans either, by law. Their law describes pretty exact, what trans is. The law I would fall under is the law for intersex people, which makes life there much easier than here, because all services are open to us.
But anyway, no, I am not even close to TERF ideology, I am, however, consider myself to belong to the third generation feminist grouping.

Hugs
Linde
 

Kenna

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Linde, As I said on another thread an hour or so ago, at a technical level you can legitimately claim to have actually detransitioned to your natural genetic state. I'm aware that you enjoy debates with the TERFs, but this could rattle them a bit should you wish to put it out there.
Hugs,
-Kenna
 

LADY SARAH

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If your birth defect had been corrected at a very early age, one could argue that you are a cis female. On the other hand, you experienced male puberty, became a man (of sorts) and fathered a child.

Based on that, your chromosomes become irrelevant. You are a trans woman. Even if you had not become married or fathered a child, you went through school and into adulthood as a male, just like I did.

I just don't go making it anybody's business, as I am sure you don't. We just can't lie to ourselves about this matter.
 

Linde

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Linde, As I said on another thread an hour or so ago, at a technical level you can legitimately claim to have actually detransitioned to your natural genetic state. I'm aware that you enjoy debates with the TERFs, but this could rattle them a bit should you wish to put it out there.
Hugs,
-Kenna
I have to mill that one over, Kenna!

Hugs
Linde
 

Linde

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If your birth defect had been corrected at a very early age, one could argue that you are a cis female. On the other hand, you experienced male puberty, became a man (of sorts) and fathered a child.
No, Sarah, I did not have a male puberty, I had no puberty at all. I just grew up and got older, no secondary male sex characteristics could be found on my body. But I lived as a man, and I fathered a child (I think, and hope), the Mayo docs still don't know how that happened, cause they considered me to be sterile. I got part of my puberty during my mid to end sixties, and that was a female type of puberty, when my boobs started to grow.
I am a pretty screwed up pile of human biology!

Hugs
Linde
 

LADY SARAH

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No, Sarah, I did not have a male puberty, I had no puberty at all. I just grew up and got older, no secondary male sex characteristics could be found on my body. But I lived as a man, and I fathered a child (I think, and hope), the Mayo docs still don't know how that happened, cause they considered me to be sterile. I got part of my puberty during my mid to end sixties, and that was a female type of puberty, when my boobs started to grow.
I am a pretty screwed up pile of human biology!

Hugs
Linde

But you were still raised as male, and lived as a man, with male genitalia.
 

Linde

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But you were still raised as male, and lived as a man, with male genitalia.
Mostly true Sarah, the first six years of my life I was raised as a girl.


Hugs
Linde
 

NancyBalik

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Linde, At the risk of coming off argumentative (not my intent), I just want to clarify why I brought up TERFs. I get it that you hate them and disagree with them. I am simply suggesting that your, my, anybody’s, femininity and claim to womanhood has nothing to do with chromosomes. If it did, none of us transgender gals could think of ourselves as women. Just my opinion, and yet I understand how your body, and your growing up experience, is amazingly unique and puts you in a unique category. You sound like an amazing gal! Nancy
 

Linde

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Nancy, I agree with you, being a woman is part what is happening in our head, the body section is mostly "decorative" with this.
The gender at birth was determined by the looks of the genitalia, and that made a baby either male or female.
I was talking about the cis thing, you are cis, if you were born in a gender and your body concurs with it. However, some babies were born with ambiguous genitalia, and those babies received a little creative cutting and stitching in their genital area, and were made y the docs into a gender they did see fit.
I have some indication that this was done with me, and I became a boy. Nobody knew anything about chromosomes in these days. But in the modern times, it is common that a karyotype test is done, and they know what biological gender the baby has. Sadly enough, they still like to do this cutting around, but most of the time the hit the correct gender.

So, back to myself, in the modern days, it would be very likely that I would be a female, and would receive gender correction surgery in a very early age. I would grow up as a female, and very likely like to be a female. I would be a cis person.
This did not happen to me, the assigned the wrong gender to me. I will now, very late in my life, get gender correction surgery, to a female, and I live as a female and like my female life.
Am I cis, once I received this surgery? The only difference would be the time when the surgery was done.

This is almost a philosophical question, to determine the time a surgery had to be done, to see if an intersex person is cis or not? I always will be intersex, because my endocrine system is still pretty mixed up, but the outside world would not know this.

Hugs
Linde
 
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Confused

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I was just snooping around a little, and came to this definition of Cis from the Oxford language dictionary

"Cis-gen-der
adjective
denoting or relating to a person whose sense of personal identity and gender corresponds with their birth sex."

What would I be after if had SRS? My birth sex should have been female, according to my chromosomes, and just because the doc did not realize I had a birth defect, did not really make me male, he just declared me to be a male, because he did not know better.
Once i had my corrective surgery, to handle my birth defect, my personal identity, as well as my body appearance and gender would correspondent with my birth sex.

Wii i be cis after the surgery? What do you all think?

Hugs
Linde


I think you already know my opinion is yes! You were forced to experience part of your life as a man because of intersex and AMAB. I should be the one everyone thinks is crazy, but somehow it works in reverse, and I get a pass.

Hugs,
Mike
 

Emma

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I think we are what we are. A chromosomal test may help inform things, and surgery can correct intersex and trans conditions with the body.

You are intersex with a female gender. While you were forced to live as a male for a number of years it did not change the fact that your an intersex woman and that there’s is absolutely nothing wrong with that. I know other intersex women transitioning including a close friend. Her body even makes its own estrogen which is totally cool.

Let’s take myself as an example. I knew I was trans from my earliest memories. Yet I lived as a male for a number of years. The act of living as a male didn’t make me less trans or mean that I wasn’t trans. Living as a male wreaked great harm to myself and my life over the years for which I could go on about for days. Now that I’ve transitioned, I’m still not cis. What I am is the same thing I’ve been from the beginning which is a trans female. And there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that. It’s like saying I’m a brunette. It takes nothing away from my womanhood just as being intersexed takes nothing away from your womanhood. At the end of the day, we’re all women. Some are cis, some are Intersex, some are trans.

I know this is a philosophical exercise and the reality is your identity is what it is and is not for me or anyone else to define. That ability is yours alone. :).

Em;
 
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Linde

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Thank for sharing your thoughts with us, Emma.
One thing, please don't call us intersexed, because it doesn't feel right to be called like this, because we are intersex, and have certain syndromes.

Intersexed feels as bad as transgendered, and we should not use those terms.

Thanks
LInde
 
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Emma

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Thank for sharing your thoughts with us, Emma.
One thing, please don't call us intersexed, because it doesn't feel right to be called like this, because we are intersex, and have certain syndromes.

Intersexed feels as bad as transgendered, and we should not use those terms.

Thanks
LInde
A good point. I missed that. Thanks. I meant no offense. Intersex it is. I felt it was only right that I go back through and edit my previous comment to make it correct.
 

Michelle_P

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In my own case, I will always consider myself to be a person of transgender history. The doctor clearly checked the "wrong" box on the birth certificate :) and I have never fully identified with any gender other than female, although I did have a sort of male phenotype growing up.

I suspect that as medical and biological science learns more, that eventually the biology behind a transgender identity may be considered as a sort of intersex condition. That doesn't affect the treatment, or the cultural impact, of course.

Ultimately, its just a label, a mere descriptive adjective that shouldn't carry all the cultural drama that is currently attached.
 

Linde

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I do not fully agree with you Michelle throwing intersex into the average transgender symptoms . If a person is clearly visible different than the average population (as was the case with me), one gets treated different (most of the time not very nice), and that has a certain influence on the cultural development of such a person. My treatment was also slightly different, but I agree that there should not be any drama attached to the entire issue of trans/intersex people.
I personally see my transition from my male presentation to my female one as over, and it is part of my path to become the woman I am these days, and I don't consider myself as being a trans woman, but simply a woman.

Hugs
Linde
 
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